Chairman Bryan Pack stated this has been a discussion for many weeks now. We are close to moving it forward. Mike Rodriguez stated that he gave examples of density on a percentage basis for Crossing at Red Desert Estates, the Multi-Family development at southeast corner of 800 South and Main Street. Originally, the applicant came in with the entire parcel developed with townhomes, but because there was a strip of R-2-6 zoning on the East end of that, they were required to do twinhomes on that parcel. On the original application, the entire site, which is a little over 10 acres with 6 unit buildings and 40 unit buildings that calculated out to a density of 115440 sq ft total sq footage of building area out of a total of 447078 so a density of just under 26%. That would be the amount in just a townhome development. Commissioner Lance Anderson inquired how much were they allowing for amenities? Mike Rodriguez stated minimal open space, so a density of 16.5 units per acre and 29525 sq ft usable open space. The required 10 percent is almost 45000 sq ft of open space. He also recalculated it taking into consideration the twinhome development, which came out to 19.5% density on the Multi-Family and 22% on twinhomes with 29525 sq ft of open space. We require 10% of open space on multi-family developments. It is based on the number of units. 800 sq ft for the first two dwelling units and 200 sq ft thereafter. Dale Coulam stated the density percentage went up on twinhomes but partly because those would be actual lots. Those would not be the same calculation because it requires an actual lot size versus multi-family which considers an entire lot site taking the footprint to use the percentage basis. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated and there are different setbacks for all of them. Chairman Doug Clifford stated that he took a 5000 sq ft lot and put an average home with setbacks required and the density for that is 26-28% maximum you could put on there. So 15-20 percent is too low. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated that the difference is they could have 156 townhomes. If you took 447000 sq ft and with R-1-5 times that by 80% and divide it by 5000 sq ft. That is 71.5 lots. So on an R-1-5 zone, anytime we are lower than 71.5 it would be a taking. We couldn't do that as a percentage. If they did it all at 26%, 156 units is almost double the units. 26% is too much. It doesn't create a lifestyle. Chairman Bryan Pack stated if we stick to 13, 14 or 15 percent and have a clause that no matter what it can't go lower than an R-1-5, so 71.5 lots and then add incentives for amenities, getting up to 25%. Start at 15% and end at 25%. Dale Coulam stated he likes the savings clause, but he has a hard time applying percentages to an R-1-5. State that it needs to end up with the same number of units as you would in a R-1-5. Commissioner Jeff Loris stated it took a 1500 sq ft number as an average house times that by 70 lots that is 105000 sq ft. 435600 sq ft subtracting from 105000 sq ft is still 24% of the total area used. We have run this every way in every subdivision, and really what it comes down to is that an R-1-5 is using 25% of their land for an average unit. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated that is a big house for a 5000 sq ft lot. Commissioner Jeff Loris stated this is the average number of where to start at our restrictions of density allowances is completely wrong because they would get 24% just from the R-1-5. Chairman Bryan Pack stated that is not the way he looks at it. It is the number of lots. Ignore the percentages on this when you are doing the calculations. The only reason we are looking at R-1-5 is to preserve it from being a taking. They can't get any less number of lots on their multi-family than if they were to do an R-1-5. So 24 is okay there because it gets them to 70 lots. Then when you switch over to percentages we would do on a multi-family, if they start at 15% they can do that if they do smaller units they can get more than 71 units. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated the logic is correct but the average is too high. It would be more like 12-1300 sq ft house. Chairman Bryan Pack stated so if we start at 15% we incentivize smaller units which is good in Multi-Family and provides some affordable housing as well as getting amenities that make them a livable community. Commissioner Jeff Loris stated that we would have to apply it. Dale Coulam stated that we are talking about densities for Multi-Family and R-1-5 is not Multi-Family and so this calculation does not apply to that zone, but it is the first zone in a high density residential use, so we have to make sure you get at least the same number of units so it stays within high density. By figuring out what that is and having a savings clause that in no event do you end up with a density that is less than the number of units you could get in an R-1-5 then everything else in multi-family can be done in percentages if that is the way you want to define it. Chairman Bryan Pack stated so it is not set in stone, but let's start at 15% and end at 25% and figure out the incentives we want to create. Smaller units might be a natural incentive. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated that if they are building two story units they can get more amenities in a two story building. Chairman Bryan Pack stated that he has heard that perhaps a clubhouse is as beneficial as the current ordinance seems to think it is. The biggest bonus should maybe be outdoor recreation space or open space. Commissioner Doug Clifford stated even walking paths would be better. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated if we need to give a finding as to why it doesn't work. Only a few people get to enjoy the clubhouse. A bigger pool allows more people to enjoy it. He wants people to have a house and enjoy their environment. What will give the people in that development the most enjoyment? Chairman Bryan Pack stated there are four categories in the old ordinance. Clubhouse was Category A. Category B was swimming pool, tennis courts, multi use sports courts, and similar nature. Category C was childrens play area, basketball court, pavillion, gazebo, walking path. Commissioner Jeff Loris stated that should be more heavily weighted. Chairman Bryan Pack stated Category D are amenities like security lighting, outdoor barbecue, picnic tables, sandbox, volleyball court, those seems to fit into Category C as well. We could reduce the amounts to say that if you do all of these you get 10%, and then carve up that 10% among these four categories. We will put numbers in here and then think about it and let Commissioner Bob Morris be involved in the conversation. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated security lighting should have no bonus for that. It doesn't give anyone more enjoyment of life. Clubhouse is a big open word and what they put into one. Chairman Bryan Pack stated let us put 2%. Commissioner Doug Clifford stated that Category C has the items people would enjoy the most, so it should be the highest number. Chairman Bryan Pack stated that maybe saying 10% if they do them all is carving them up to small. You get to pick up to 10% with the highest number being outdoor and maybe put Category C at 5 or 7%. Commissioner Doug Clifford stated then they choose. Chairman Bryan Pack stated so let's do 5% for Category C. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated take out security lighting and give Category D 5%. Category C and D are the same types of amenities. Commissioner Doug Clifford stated maybe we don't have Category C and D, we just have Category C which includes everything in there. You do need walking paths and picnic areas and things like that. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated so let's leave Category C the way it is, and move basketball court to Category B and then combine Category C and D and move volleyball and tennis court up to Category B. Chairman Bryan Pack stated so Category D we can just carve it up where outdoor barbecue is more like amenities in Category C, picnic tables and sandbox is the same, volleyball court goes up in Category B. Horse shoe pit put in Category C. Eliminate Category D. Commissioner Jeff Loris suggested carving out a category for swimming pools by itself. Commissioner Jeff Loris stated make Category B by itself. Water like splash pad, etc. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated that the problem is how detailed do we get like size of pool etc. We may need subcategories under these four categories because how do you weight the difference between a pool and a splash pad. Chairman Bryan Pack stated that he would be comfortable putting a splash pad in with the basketball court. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated so let's say 2% on clubhouse and pool by itself at 3% or 4%, and put 5% on the other two categories. Go with that and be thinking about how we want to distinguish the cap. Chairman Bryan Pack stated our next discussion will be what is going to meet the criteria for these different categories and the percentages.
Chairman Bryan Pack stated last time we had Commissioner Bob Morris give us his ideas so be sure to read those. Commissioner Lance Anderson inquired if we are staying on the mandate of what City Council gave us? Chairman Bryan Pack stated he sees two separate things we are trying to accomplish. One is to address the few items that City Council set in their meeting, which is electronic message boards, canopy lighting, drive-through lighting and amphitheater lighting. We are not doing the night sky initiative at this point, but they wanted us to look at those. We are also looking at the overall scheme as well. That will take more time, because we need to understand the difference between kelvins. We know where Bob Morris and Lance Anderson stands on things. Dale Coulam prepared an ordinance for us and the only things we changed are in red and are very minor, which was define message board and put some restrictions on them. His understanding is that canopy lighting and drive through lighting are already addressed in our ordinance as it currently exists. Dale Coulam stated those components were in the zoning ordinance so when we consolidate and look at outdoor lighting you will see all of the regulations. That consolidation has been renumbered as Chapter 23 of the zoning ordinance and that will be its new designation. There may be some formatting issues that would be helpful to maybe break things out in their own sections. A simple way to handle electronic message boards would be by making a definition, and add them to the prohibited list. What you have now is a compilation of ordinances that already exist. We already had in place such a restrictive ordinance that has been in place for the last decade and others think we need to add things that are already covered. It is a useful review to go through. He would caution spending too much time on this and do that at a later time. Electronic message boards have been a glaring gap in our ordinance for quite some time and he points to Mountain America Credit Union as an example. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated that maybe we should pass those smaller items onto City Council right now so we don't have that issue. Dale Coulam stated you can tweak as you go through and format it to make it easier to read. Move this on for recommendation to City Council and in the future there may be a more in-depth discussion out there. Chairman Bryan Pack stated we need to recognize we are not addressing the whole ordinance, send these items to City Council, and revisit this later. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated that some people think we are revising the whole ordinance. He is passionate about not wanting it diluted. Other communities have taken on our ordinance. Ivins, since 1977 when he first lived here, has been able to see the night sky. He really appreciates that. It is dark enough by his home that he can see the lights coming off of Mesquite. Chairman Bryan Pack stated that they both bring valuable insights to the group and Commissioner Bob Morris just as much so, on the other side of the spectrum. There are valid concerns out there. No one is proposing that we sacrifice safety. That is a high priority. Commissioner Lance Anderson stated that it has worked well so far for 12 years. We have a track record.